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Post by Joel on Aug 14, 2018 12:32:54 GMT -5
I think this is pretty solid evidence. Consistently 90+. That is pretty good for AI. What were his WRs like? For those 3 years he had: Kenny Golliday who stayed at 64-66 ish. So he did have a good WR and played in a spread system. Other guys that came and went seemed like high 40, low 50 guys, but they never amassed any more than 500 yards. Golliday was a consistent 1400+ yards a season guy |
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Post by Nick on Aug 14, 2018 12:39:24 GMT -5
I think that it shows 5-9 is not a death blow to a QB. There may be some sort of effect, but it doesn't appear all consuming - if it exists at all.
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Post by Joel on Aug 14, 2018 12:57:22 GMT -5
I think that it shows 5-9 is not a death blow to a QB. There may be some sort of effect, but it doesn't appear all consuming - if it exists at all. And Garrisson’s bars are considerably better than this guy I found. |
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Post by Nick on Aug 14, 2018 13:04:16 GMT -5
Jeremy's bars maybe not so good though?
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Post by Bighouserulez on Aug 14, 2018 13:59:10 GMT -5
So it can be done. Let me check the leagues and see what the best smaller QB was and is. GML is the easiest because of the database- gml.fof-belco.com/playercard.php?playerid=2559619th all time ratings leader and 5 foot 11. gml.fof-belco.com/playercard.php?playerid=3568120th all time and again 5 foot 11 There were two other 5 foot 11 guys in the top 40 and one 5 foot 10 guy- This dude is still active- gml.fof-belco.com/playercard.php?playerid=51718This guy is the smallest with the best creds i could find at QB there and he is 5 foot 9- gml.fof-belco.com/playercard.php?playerid=50849Wow NAFL only had one guy at 5 foot 9 Heath Brodie who was great but not elite. RZB has 5 foot 11 Ralph Mcneil still in the league and 18th passer rating all time. The Gmens Smith is 23rd in rating and up there. 5 foot 10 Leonard Flowers about 30th all time still active. Ok TFL i take with a grain of salt here because it is historical and players are edited- 5 foot 11 Drew Brees 12th all time passer and still active and wow i had to go down to 56th in Marc Bulger at 5 foot 10. |
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Post by Nick on Aug 14, 2018 14:03:10 GMT -5
OK so i want you do do a neat little test when you have a minute in game. Look at pass defense and over 400 passing plays to get a good barometer. YOu will see more often then not a Steve has better stats then a Jester in pass defense. It is sort of league by league the same holds true. Okay looking through this now...looking at all-time career stats sorted by most passes defended. S Kelly McKnight, S Dave James, S Gunn, S Wagner. These are all top 20 guys. It appears to me Zone is the driving force as it always has been in the past. Big sample size and consistent results. Moving on to CB. Nothing jumping out in all-time stats. All the top guys appear to be highly rated players that are good at everything. I will move on to year by year passes defended (PD) from here on. Ah my 5.30 rookie Walsh 15 PD with crappy PD. Next CB up Carisle - Zone and M2M highest bar. Bauer - Zone and M2M highest bar. Hmm, Walsh was M2M and Zone highest bar also. That is 3 in a row now. My CB Wooden up next, again M2M and Zone highest. 5th up Robbins, great at everything. Girling M2M and Zone. This is pretty conclusive. Let's look at last year. 1. Girling M2M and Zone 2. Newhart M2M and Zone 3. Nichols M2M and Zone 4. Robbins Everything 5. Bauer M2M and Zone Okay this is extremely conclusive that M2M and Zone are getting the PD's for CBs. Play diagnosis doesn't appear to have any more impact in this league than run defense. Not absolute and I am sure you must of seem something, but it is hard to believe from what I have just seen that PD is keep. 99% certain for this that it isn't. |
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Post by Nick on Aug 14, 2018 14:05:28 GMT -5
So it can be done. Let me check the leagues and see what the best smaller QB was and is. GML is the easiest because of the database- gml.fof-belco.com/playercard.php?playerid=2559619th all time ratings leader and 5 foot 11. gml.fof-belco.com/playercard.php?playerid=3568120th all time and again 5 foot 11 There were two other 5 foot 11 guys in the top 40 and one 5 foot 10 guy- This dude is still active- gml.fof-belco.com/playercard.php?playerid=51718This guy is the smallest with the best creds i could find at QB there and he is 5 foot 9- gml.fof-belco.com/playercard.php?playerid=50849Wow NAFL only had one guy at 5 foot 9 Heath Brodie who was great but not elite. RZB has 5 foot 11 Ralph Mcneil still in the league and 18th passer rating all time. The Gmens Smith is 23rd in rating and up there. 5 foot 10 Leonard Flowers about 30th all time still active. Ok TFL i take with a grain of salt here because it is historical and players are edited- 5 foot 11 Drew Brees 12th all time passer and still active and wow i had to go down to 56th in Marc Bulger at 5 foot 10. There are relatively few short QBs out there so it is no surprise they are not jumping out. If Jeremy said to me tomorrow he wanted to move 81/81 Garrison I would value him as a 71/71 guy in my own head. There could be a penalty for 5-9, but doesn't seem to severe to me. |
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Post by Strubbel94 on Aug 14, 2018 14:11:04 GMT -5
OK so i want you do do a neat little test when you have a minute in game. Look at pass defense and over 400 passing plays to get a good barometer. YOu will see more often then not a Steve has better stats then a Jester in pass defense. It is sort of league by league the same holds true. This season only 3 of 12 CB's who have double digit passes defenden have a Play Diagnosis over 50 (according to my scouts). Also all of them are great in pass coverage, so to me they look like "Jester's" Not saying that you're wrong but i dont see it the way you do, at least this season. About the WR argument, i dont know which side im on. RR has the most iimpact on the ovr rating but that doesnt seem to be the question its more about which bars are more important. I have 2 interesting players on my roster for this discussion. Player #1: Damian Athanas- Route Running: 95- Getting Downfield: 12- Big-Play: 69
Player #2: Luis Krumrei- Route Running: 46- Getting Downfield: 73- Big-Play: 86Edit: All other bars besides Endurance and 3rd down are mostly equally bad and in those two bars i mentioned Athanas is a bit better.Athanas is performing great for me, however back when i gave Krumrei more targets he tend to get more Avg/C and Avg/T. Also both guys have roughly the same amount of targets on 3rd down and eventhough Athanas has a higher catch percentage on 3rd down (he also has a much higher 3rd down bar!), he doesnt seem to move the chains consistantly. So in the end i tend to agree more with Nick on this part, but Route Running is also a very important attribute for a WR and there is defiinitley value in guys like Athanas or similar guys (just not 10 million per season). Because of his high asking price i will let Athanas walk after this season, feel free to grab this guys Wes  |
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Post by Joel on Aug 14, 2018 14:13:29 GMT -5
Ive said it before, when I take a WR, I look at their bars in this order:
1. Big play receiving
2. Route Running
3. Endurance
4. Avoid drops
If they don't have the others, it doesn't bother me
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Post by Strubbel94 on Aug 14, 2018 14:14:50 GMT -5
Ive said it before, when I take a WR, I look at their bars in this order: 1. Big play receiving 2. Route Running 3. Endurance 4. Avoid drops If they don't have the others, it doesn't bother me Then you would love Damian Athanas, but as i explained in the comment above, it appears that Krumrei has performed better when had roughly the same targets. Edit: Athanas is bad in avoid drops, my bad. |
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Post by Joel on Aug 14, 2018 14:19:32 GMT -5
Ive said it before, when I take a WR, I look at their bars in this order: 1. Big play receiving 2. Route Running 3. Endurance 4. Avoid drops If they don't have the others, it doesn't bother me Then you would love Damian Athanas, but as i explained in the comment above, it appears that Krumrei has performed better when had roughly the same targets. Edit: Athanas is bad in avoid drops, my bad. I kind of feel as though bars work together. And that is how I feel about RR and Avoid Drops. One helps them make better routes to get more targets, and the other allows them to go up and get catches. Together, if they are both high, I think you will at least have a safe WR. Add BPR, you then have the chance from all those targets for a big play, hence why I like these bars. |
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Post by Nick on Aug 14, 2018 14:22:28 GMT -5
Look at it like this. You have a one legged Octopus who can't run but will catch anything throw in his general direction. The Octopus has RR of 100, GD of 0 and BPR of 0. In reality he is totally useless. You don't want to throw him the ball.
The Leopard has 0 RR, 100 GD, 100 BPR. He has no arms so he isn't going to catch anything. Again totally useless.
The way I see it we all throw short quite a but, even the Giants. BPR is nice to have - even if we don't throw deep a lot, as we all like guys who can break it. I'm not happy if I don't have decent to good levels in all 3 bars. White, Creekmur, Henry these guys are what I like to see in terms of distribution.
Shelton, Gallop, Sinclair and Grayvil are top of the tree.
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Post by Strubbel94 on Aug 14, 2018 14:23:45 GMT -5
Then you would love Damian Athanas, but as i explained in the comment above, it appears that Krumrei has performed better when had roughly the same targets. Edit: Athanas is bad in avoid drops, my bad. I kind of feel as though bars work together. And that is how I feel about RR and Avoid Drops. One helps them make better routes to get more targets, and the other allows them to go up and get catches. Together, if they are both high, I think you will at least have a safe WR. Add BPR, you then have the chance from all those targets for a big play, hence why I like these bars. Thats for sure Athanas was a borderline 1000yards WR the last two season as my second option to Shelton thats is pretty safe and nice. But as i've looked into the stats i think Krumrei ( a high GD + BPR WR) would have done not worth i guess (in terms of single player stats). However youmight be right and it is easier to extend drives with a save WR that gives you sown with less yards to go. |
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Post by Joel on Aug 14, 2018 19:31:11 GMT -5
 I got bored, so simmed lots of years. This is a 5'9 guy who won two bowls. Looked good to me. I think the issue with finding any is that getting a good QB is rare, but a good 5'9 QB is even rarer, like an every 30-50 year thing. So jeremy, you should be proud you have one, its like having a shiny Pikachu in pokemon yellow, rare as hell  |
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Post by jeremy on Aug 14, 2018 21:28:17 GMT -5
I got bored, so simmed lots of years. This is a 5'9 guy who won two bowls. Looked good to me. I think the issue with finding any is that getting a good QB is rare, but a good 5'9 QB is even rarer, like an every 30-50 year thing. So jeremy, you should be proud you have one, its like having a shiny Pikachu in pokemon yellow, rare as hell I will cherish him... til the day I am done with him. I have Matt Stafford in the TFL. He is 90 rated, 5'10" and entering his 4th season. And his QBR has been high 70s so far. I certainly can't rule out my own incompetence, but the guy now has a great TE, two good vet WRs, and a couple solid young receivers as well. Decent o line across the board. He is set up to do well. If he doesn't perform well this year it's on me. |
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