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Post by ezlee2 on Dec 8, 2022 9:45:47 GMT -5
Just thinking about it this morning so I figured I'd share a post. When evaluating potential additions to your team (not rookies) how much stock do you put into past performance? For me, this is something that I rarely paid attention to for years, but I have for some time now and I'm convinced past production is just as important as what you see in the bars. The all-time leading rusher RB Peter Chamberlain was a great example of this IMO. Even in his twilight years with shit bars he still produced for the Bengals and Giants. I'm not saying that this is gospel, but another data point that GMs may want to take a look at. How much stock you put into it is debatable.
Thoughts?
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Post by Jimmy Johnson on Dec 8, 2022 10:01:20 GMT -5
I think past stats are all part of the big picture. I always try to look at a guy’s history before signing or making a trade. Past performance is a strong indicator of what you are getting. Now this isn’t to say that it is always the case. I’ve taken chances on players that no one else has gotten production out of just to prove to myself that I could. Sometimes it pans out and sometimes it doesn’t.
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Post by hildebrand on Dec 8, 2022 10:40:59 GMT -5
Bars 100%. There's too many other factors that go into stats like chemistry, cohesion, offensive/defensive system, quality of teammates, etc. that the stats are more often than not skewed depending on what team the player is on.
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Post by Adam Schefter on Dec 8, 2022 11:19:14 GMT -5
I'm convinced past production is just as important as what you see in the bars. The all-time leading rusher RB Peter Chamberlain was a great example of this IMO. Even in his twilight years with shit bars he still produced for the Bengals and Giants. I'm not saying that this is gospel, but another data point that GMs may want to take a look at. Thoughts? Dillon ?
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Post by Joel on Dec 8, 2022 11:26:04 GMT -5
I fully believe in just the bars… Because if you believed in stats, then you’d have to say Bradford WR and Buchman WR are bums, when I know that if I had them, they’d throw up the same stats as Fleming
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Post by ezlee2 on Dec 8, 2022 11:45:18 GMT -5
Oh, I'm a bars guy no doubt, but I recall the discussion about Jim originally not even wanting to have the bars on players when he made the game but added it down the road. This tells me that this has to have some merit. A great example is special teams players. There is a clear trend in tackles and FF that some guys are just flat-out consistent and others suck despite the big ST bar. Like I said, this is not gospel, but rather something to chat about.
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tzach
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Post by tzach on Dec 8, 2022 12:05:57 GMT -5
bars and combines for me. there's those 1% of players that i'm convinced that the bars we see are not the true bars.
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Post by ezlee2 on Dec 8, 2022 12:09:21 GMT -5
bars and combines for me. there's those 1% of players that i'm convinced that the bars we see are not the true bars. So this is what would account for guys that look like shit putting up big numbers? I know a solid game plan can manipulate that for sure as we have all seen, but are you saying there is a hidden "X" factor that some guys just have and they will perform regardless of what the bars look like?
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tzach
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Post by tzach on Dec 8, 2022 12:10:25 GMT -5
just speculation from my side!
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Post by Sawblade300 on Dec 8, 2022 12:34:05 GMT -5
I'm like Zach. I'll take bars and combines to choose a guy. Sometimes in a draft I'll take a guy that looks like he has crap bars, but great combines in the hopes those bars are phony and will come up.
For established players in FA, it's strictly bars. sometimes I looks at past performance, but that depends on the position. QBs could be shit in the wrong system even though the bars are good. Get them in the right system, used the right way and they shine. I've been on both ends of this. For defensive players, if they play bad, they play bad...regardless of bars. That's my experience anyway.
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tzach
Franchise Owner
Bench Warmer
Browns GM
Posts: 426
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Post by tzach on Dec 8, 2022 12:47:51 GMT -5
oh i was talking about veteran combines!
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Post by ezlee2 on Dec 8, 2022 13:06:51 GMT -5
Just to be clear, I am not saying that I believe stats over bars. In fact, I should have worded the topic better. I just meant do you take into account past production and if so how much weight do you give it?
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Post by Bighouserulez on Dec 8, 2022 13:26:25 GMT -5
Stats are a major factor as to if a player is as good as his bars say.
I want big red bars but i do not want an 81 rated QB that is performing like a 60 rated QB.
Same thing vice versa i always look at stats on free agents first before putting in an offer. The worst signing i had one year was a Huge 90 rated DE in one of my leagues that ended up underperforming and killed my cap movement.
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Post by ezlee2 on Dec 8, 2022 14:42:16 GMT -5
Stats are a major factor as to if a player is as good as his bars say. I want big red bars but i do not want an 81 rated QB that is performing like a 60 rated QB.
Same thing vice versa i always look at stats on free agents first before putting in an offer. The worst signing i had one year was a Huge 90 rated DE in one of my leagues that ended up underperforming and killed my cap movement. This is exactly what I was referring to.
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Post by Bighouserulez on Dec 8, 2022 15:29:32 GMT -5
Stats are a major factor as to if a player is as good as his bars say. I want big red bars but i do not want an 81 rated QB that is performing like a 60 rated QB.
Same thing vice versa i always look at stats on free agents first before putting in an offer. The worst signing i had one year was a Huge 90 rated DE in one of my leagues that ended up underperforming and killed my cap movement. This is exactly what I was referring to. I also have to add in that sadly sometimes it comes to mismanagement from some owners too. The previous stats will show up showing signs of greatness but not reach the next level. Qbs are the big ones in my mind or WRs. If you build an offense around them it becomes unstoppable. If you do not know how to gameplan for those two players you put the player into mediocrity. I will use Ben as an example here. If he has a 50-60 rated player he is trading and is not a cap casualty i am not buying....Stay away. If Nick is trading you a player and you see to have a deal then most likely you have been Nick'd on a big red bar overrated talent.
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